49 replies to this topic

[Guthlac]

http://www.express.c...and-s-raw-deal-



ENGLISH nationalism is on the rise with more people describing themselves as English rather than British.

A report out today says a perceived failure by political parties to stand up for England’s interests risks a backlash from voters.

The Future  Of England survey found that 35 per cent of English voters believe Scottish devolution has worsened the way Britain is governed – double the proportion in 2007.

They also believe the English get a raw deal from devolution, with 45 per cent saying Scotland gets “more than its fair share of public spending”.

Almost as many, 40 per cent, say England gets “less than its fair share” of public money, the study by Cardiff and Edinburgh Universities and the think-tank IPPR found.

IPPR director Nick Pearce said: “English identity is on the rise and it is increasingly expressed in terms that are resentful of the devolution settlement.

“Mainstream political parties need to embrace Englishness, take it seriously, and find new ways of giving it political expression.

“The longer debate is ignored, or worse, denied, the more likely a backlash within England against the UK.”

The proportion of those who describe themselves as English rather than British (40 per cent) is more than double that of those who do the opposite (16 per cent).

More than half (52 per cent) of the 1,507 people quizzed say Scotland’s economy benefits more from being in the UK.

Only 22 per cent think Scotland should be independent but 79 per cent say Scottish MPs should not vote on English laws.


The so-called 'main-stream parties' and state are racist against the indigenous ethnic English, the True English people. They have been doing their best to wipe us out and deny us in all areas. The so-called 'main-stream parties' should get out of the way, because they will be replaced by an English Party for ethnic English people. England and the English will once again be independent of the UK and EU.  And an ethnic English nationalist party will be in government in an English only parliament.

Come in the lab/lib/cons/UK and EU your time is up. Goodbye and good riddance.

[Andy]

Guthlac, on 23 January 2012 - 02:40 AM, said:

The so-called main stream parties and state are racist against the indigenous ethnic English, the True English people. They have been doing their best to wipe us out and deny us in all areas. The so-called main stream parties should get out of the way, because they will be replaced by a English Party for ethnic English people. England and the English will once again be independent of the UK and EU.  And an ethnic English nationalist party will be in government in an English only parliament.

Come in the lab/lib/cons/UK and EU your time is up. Goodbye and good riddance.

I believe that this two tier democracy is down to the fact that should England have a parliament then like Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland an English nationalist party will rise to the front of politics in England.  It may be that the Conservatives and Labour will have to become English supportive in order to keep any political power.  Whatever, it will mean more political power to England.

Whoever that English party is they will have to look at the inequality of the Barnett Formula.  Giving England her fair share of the revenue will mean the end of scotland< wales and northern irelands free prescriptions etc.

It will push on towards an end to this Union as the Celtic nations finaly live on thier fair share of revenues they will once again become bitter towards England, just as they have always been prior to the preferential treatment of Devolution.

I wonder what else the English are resentful of but this biased study failed to ask?

[Andy]

Scots devolution has been a raw deal for English say voters south of the border


By James Slack
Last updated at 12:04 AM on 23rd January 2012


English voters say they have received a raw deal from devolution – with Scots pocketing more than their ‘fair share’ of public funding.

The finding comes in a report that says people living in England – who have an average of £1,600 a year less spent upon them than the Scots – have become more assertively ‘English’.
They place much greater emphasis on their English rather than their British identity, according to a study by the IPPR think-tank and Edinburgh and Cardiff universities.


Hit for six: Alex Salmond claims David Cameron snubbed him six times in six months

The findings will stoke the row over the SNP’s plan to hold a referendum on full Scottish independence.  
Yesterday, SNP leader Alex Salmond took to the airwaves to call for a ‘positive relationship of equals between Scotland and England’.
Then maybe he should, to stir the shit' ask to speak to representatives for England not Britain which is what Westmisnter is!
He also claimed Prime Minister David Cameron had snubbed his calls for a meeting to discuss his 2014 referendum plans ‘six times over the last six months’.  
The Future of England survey shows the number of voters in England who believe Scottish devolution has made the way Britain is governed worse has doubled since 2007 to 35 per cent.
Some 45 per cent of voters in England say that Scotland gets ‘more than its fair share of public spending’ – almost double the percentage in 2000.  
Meanwhile, 40 per cent of voters south of the Border say England gets ‘less than its fair share’ of public money.  
Sorry I had to cut out the picture of the Scot flag waving, dress wearing bloke.

Most – 52 per cent – say Scotland’s economy benefits more than England’s from being in the UK, while less than one in four believes England and Scotland’s economies benefit equally.
The Treasury’s Public Expenditure Statistics recently projected UK  Government annual spending per person as £8,588 in England – and
£10,212 in Scotland.
The survey found that, while support for Scottish independence remains low at  22 per cent, the English strongly support the view that the current devolved settlement should be reformed.
Eight out of ten English voters support ‘devolution-max’ – which means giving Scotland full fiscal autonomy but not independence.  

Support for the status quo has now fallen to one in four of the English electorate.

Almost six out of ten say that they do not trust the UK Government to work in the best long-term interests of England.  

Nick Pearce, IPPR director, said: ‘English identity is on the rise and it is increasingly expressed in terms that are resentful of the devolution settlement.’

Richard Wyn Jones, professor of politics at Cardiff University, said: ‘There is strong evidence that English identity is becoming increasingly politicised. The more English a person feels the more likely they are to be dissatisfied with the way that the UK is being governed post-devolution.’
Scottish Lib Dem leader Willie Rennie said: ‘It’s important the rest of the UK understands that most people in Scotland support the UK. Alex Salmond and the SNP do not speak for most people in Scotland on separation.’
A Scottish Labour spokesman said: ‘With Alex Salmond using every opportunity to drive a wedge between the two countries, it is no surprise resentment is growing.’
Speaking on Sky News’s Murnaghan programme, Mr Salmond said: ‘We will share a monarch, we will share a currency and, under our proposals, we will share a social union, but we won’t have diktats from Westminster for Scotland and we won’t have Scottish MPs poking their nose into English business in the Commons.’
Mr Salmond added: ‘There have been a lot of rather injudicious things said by Westminster politicians about Scotland.
‘I will be a lot more positive about the future of England than people like David Cameron have been hitherto about the future of Scotland.’

[Andy]

The negative points to the Scots show English resentment in full, I also added my own negative marks.

[Andy]

And here is something of a different slant on the study.  There is nothing to suggest England should leave the Union but certainly is proof England should have its own Parliament..

http://www.telegraph...nds-report.html

English 'backlash' on devolution begins, finds report

More than half the English think England should go it alone in the first real signs of a backlash over devolution, a report said today.

Photo: Alamy




By Tom Whitehead, Home Affairs Editor
6:50AM GMT 23 Jan 2012


England should either have its own parliament or only English MPs should vote on English laws, according to the survey by the Institute for Public Policy Research (ippr) think tank.

The report, The Dog That Finally Barked, said four in ten people identify themselves as English before British, more than twice the proportion for vice versa.
And eight in ten believe Scotland should break all financial ties – the so called “devolution max” – because it benefits unfairly from the current relationship.

But a quarter of people said they had no confidence in the ability of any political party to stand up for the interests of England.

The research comes as Scotland’s ruling Scottish National Party this week launches a consultation on its plans for a referendum on future independence.
The ippr report said it was surprising that an “English backlash” did not materialise after devolution to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland but that “there are now signs that stirring within England is beginning to take shape”.

The English survey found more than half said Scotland’s economy benefits more than England’s from being in the UK and only one in four now support the status quo.
Nick Pearce, ippr director, said: “English identity is on the rise and it is increasingly expressed in terms that are resentful of the devolution settlement.
“Our mainstream political parties need to embrace Englishness, take it seriously, and find new ways of giving it political expression.
“The longer this debate is ignored, or worse, denied, the more likely we will see a backlash within England against the UK."
Richard Wyn Jones, Professor of Politics at Cardiff University and co-author of the report, added: “Despite the exhortations of successive governments that have focused exclusively on Britishness, it is clear that at the popular level it is Englishness that resonates most.”

[Woden's Child]

Quote

Nick Pearce, ippr director, said: “English identity is on the rise and it is increasingly expressed in terms that are resentful of the devolution settlement.
“Our mainstream political parties need to embrace Englishness, take it seriously, and find new ways of giving it political expression.
“The longer this debate is ignored, or worse, denied, the more likely we will see a backlash within England against the UK."
Richard Wyn Jones, Professor of Politics at Cardiff University and co-author of the report, added: “Despite the exhortations of successive governments that have focused exclusively on Britishness, it is clear that at the popular level it is Englishness that resonates most.”

Why do I get the feeling that, if asked, it would be civic Englishness that is being referred to here, and also in regard to those four in ten who regard themselves as English?  Take away the blacks and Asians who were asked the question and how many actual ethnic English referred to themselves as English??

[Andy]

http://ippr.org/publ...tical-community

This report presents evidence which suggests the emergence of a new kind of Anglo-British identity in which the English component is increasingly the primary source of attachment for English people. It also suggests that English identity is becoming more politicised: that is, the more English a person feels, the more likely they are to believe that the current structure of the UK is unfair and to support a particularly English dimension to the governance of England.



Executive summary.......................................................................................................2
Introduction: the English enigma..................................................................................4
1. The Future of England Survey...................................................................................7
2. Devolution: the view from England...........................................................................9
3. England emerges.....................................................................................................13
4. England as a nascent political community .............................................................18
5. The political consequences of English identity ......................................................26
6. Conclusion: England and the problem of British politics........................................31

[Witnere]

Again, they recognise the issue, but they're only prepared to offer a solution that will break England into regions. The fuckers just don't quit it do they?

[Andy]

Woden, on 23 January 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

Why do I get the feeling that, if asked, it would be civic Englishness that is being referred to here?  

Most certainly.  I think whilst reading the actual report it does allude to their being 'other reasons' for our sense of developing Englishness but avoids going into these areas.

In respect of trends in national identity, the report finds that:
we already know that national identity is another word for civic identity, it includes anyone and everyone in England as per the 2011 Census.
English identity appears to be stronger than British identity – or the English component of dual English-British identity stronger than the British component – across England’s diverse regions (including London) and across all social and demographic groups, with one exception: members of ethnic minorities, who place much greater emphasis on their British identity. The report, however, also points to tentative evidence of a growth in English identification within ethnic minority communities in recent years, albeit from a lower base.

Proof that these ethnic minorities are not integrating....not that we want them here in any case.
The report can be read here;

http://ippr.org/imag...an2012_8542.pdf



by turning their backs on Britishness and embracing an avowedly English identity – an identity which many seem to assume is somehow inherently more xenophobic and less inclusive (particularly of ethnic minorities) that British or indeed Scottish and Welsh identities.

[Andy]

Witnere, on 23 January 2012 - 10:54 AM, said:

Again, they recognise the issue, but they're only prepared to offer a solution that will break England into regions. The fuckers just don't quit it do they?

It makes note of Regionalisation;

.........as Labour was to discover during its abortive attempts to create regional assemblies in England.

[Andy]

Constitutional options for England


Stronger local councils.....................................................17

Elected regional assemblies throughout England................12

  
An English parliament......................................................36

UK government................................................................24

EU.................................................................................0

Other.............................................................................1

Don’t know..................................................................10


Well looks like an English Parlaiment wins hands down.....totally missed by the media.

[Andy]

Should St Georges day be a public holiday.

Agree strongly.............47


Tend to agree..............27


  
Tend to disagree .........8



Disagree strongly ........4



Don’t know ...............13

[Andy]

43 White British? considered themselves English first
36 White British consider themselves English and British.

whilst

19 non white British thought themselves as English first....(deluded or lying)


The report states...............

Moreover, even if the inference is correct that members of ethnic minorities living in England find Englishness a less amenable identity than Britishness, we would simply point out that there is nothing inevitable about this state of affairs. There is strong evidence from Scotland, for example, that the sub-state identity can pr ove more inclusive of ethnic minority immigrants and their descendents than the state-wide equivalent; the same is almost certainly true in Wales. One obvious difference between the Scottish and Welsh case and the experience in England is that the political class in England, with some minor exceptions, have made little effort to promote Englishness as an inclusive and tolerant identity. Instead, they continue to focus their energies espousing the merits of Britishness, ignoring the fact that it is English identity that has become emboldened in r ecent years. Even without such intervention, there are tentative signs that ethnic minorities are becoming less reluctant to embrace Englishness than in the past.

[Steven]

What the fuck has Englisc identity got to do with Fabian socialist words like 'inclusive' and 'tolerent', it's none of their business. These cunts won't take no for an answer, we ain't giving our identity away and they know it. If you've got something to give away then do it, but don't give away what's not yours in the first place. At this rate there'll be fuck all people left in the world who you can identify as real. They are obviously unaware that to interfere with the identity of any ethnic group is unlawful under international law. Despite the best efforts of the politicians to write us off the Englisc are down at the UN as a Nation, as in People. Strewth!

From Part 6. (Andy #7)

'More significantly, perhaps, the strengthening and politicisation of English
identity is taking place in the absence of any formal political mobilisation. Englishness, in
other words, has a momentum of its own.'

So, what they're really worried about is not being able to control it (Englisc identity) politically from a central point, i.e. the LibLabCon. Well fuck 'em.

Steve

[edmundy]

Just four out of ten consider themselves as English first,when it should be nine out of ten (allowing for the ethnic.) These polls show just how close the Powers that be are to completing their 'great game'. In five years it would be three per ten,five after that just one...Thank God we are awake now and are determined to shake this country up!

[Guthlac]

Woden, on 23 January 2012 - 10:27 AM, said:

Why do I get the feeling that, if asked, it would be civic Englishness that is being referred to here, and also in regard to those four in ten who regard themselves as English?  Take away the blacks and Asians who were asked the question and how many actual ethnic English referred to themselves as English??

Yes the 'so-called civic English' are as just as anti-real English as the UK unionists.

A typical liberal anti English ploy. If English matters are not going in the liberal unionist favour they fall back on the political civic fake identity of anyone is English. In other words the same old civic politically constructed Britishness identity that has nothing to do with the true English. English civics are not English patriots and not English. To be English means exactly that, you have to be ethnically English. There is no halfway house.
........................

The politicians and media see this as an opportunity to push EU regions on to the English, we do not want regions we have our shire/county councils. They come out with the liberal stamp of calling us a community. Well very few people used the word community in England when referring to England and the native English. The word 'community was only pushed to the fore when the state decided on immigration and began using it as reference to immigrants.

..Real English people do not belong to a 'community' They belong to a Nation. And that Nation is the one and only English Nation, that of the native ethnic English people.'  There are no other English people or other English nation. Anyone living in England who is not ethnic English is not part of the English Nation. They are foreigners living in England.

Personally with the census and media, I use them where they are useful to us and ignore them where they are not. I believe it is up to to set our own path, our own agenda.

No compromise on our identity and one true English Nation. No comprise on 'regions', No compromise on so called 'community', we are not 'a community' we are folk and Nation.  No compromise on a so-called 'political identity'. The English are not a 'political identity' (a convenient liberal term to avoid acknowledging the real English people and our identity), the English are a naturally evolved ethnicity and culture. They are not a mere 'political identity' thought up in the heads of political manoeuvres and side-liners.


... No Weakening, No Faltering, Hold Fast, Stand Firm and Resolute.

[Woodsman]

From page 31...


"This development clearly represents a serious challenge – or, more correctly, a series of
challenges – both socially and politically. As we have already made clear, while English
identity is shared geographically across the territory, encompassing even those areas
with a strong sense of ‘regional identity’, and while it is also shared broadly across social
groups, there remains one significant outlier: members of ethnic minorities currently tend to
remain significantly more British and less English in terms of their sense of national identity.
This is not, in our view, an insurmountable difficulty, and there is tentative evidence that
attitudes within ethnic minority communities are beginning to consider English identity more
favourably than in the past, but it is clearly a matter on which proponents of an English
dimension need to reflect. And in fairness, a number are doing just that."


This bit worries me a lot... clearly the authors of the report just don't believe in an English ethnic identity. It is their desire to see 'Englishness' corrupted and devalued into a civic identity much the same as 'British'. Their intent is clearly to rig the rules of the game, in which any third world immigrant who washes ashore can embrace 'Englishness' as theirs.

The politicians will be aware of growing English nationalism and will try and steer that movement in a direction they can more easily control. The politicians will get on their soap boxes and give fine pro English speech's, whilst actually advocating a civic 'Englishness' which just happens to let recent immigrants, and those of immigrant stock, lay claim to a English identity... the old "After all, we're all immigrants" bullshit.

This is going to be a classic political game of divide and rule. They will try and drive a wedge between those supporters of 'civic Englishness', and those who  endorse an identity based on ancient English lineage. They will be the moderates, we will be portrayed as the racists and extremists. And with the full weight of the BBC pumping out civic nonsense, and echoed by the Guardian, our job may actually be made tougher as people start to embrace an 'English' identity not of our liking, but one molded to suit the state.

[Andy]

We English have just to stick to our guns in regards to our identity.  We will be the mirror that shows them to be what they are PAkistani or African etc but not English.

The Wankers are trying to turn English into some British or American identity which is no real identity.

[Guthlac]

Well I have left my replies in the two papers comments, if they post them is another thing. A good opportunity to air our views.

[Harold Godwinsson]

They are getting the Message that Englisc Ethnic Identity is on the rise, it has no Political backing or support among the main Stream, it is rising under its own steam, rising from the street...

That creates problems for the Establishment, and the Lib/Lab/Con Tri-Party pact of Power, without support from the main stream, it can not be controled by the Elites, which frighten's the Elites...

Another problem is the rise in Englisc Nationalism and Identity, also puts the Union in Queer Street, and the Establishment can only keep their Stake in the preservation alive by Holding onto England and by keeping the englisc under the umbrella term of british.. But with the rise of Englisc Ethnic Nationalism and Identity, putting the british identity into question, their Union is also under question, you see, its not Scotland, or Wales or NI that threaten's the preservation of their Beloved Union, its England, and the rise of Englisc Ethnic Identity and Nation hood, without any main stream support puts the idea of everything they want to hold onto at risk, hence the reasons behind abolishing the very name and idea of England with 'Britain' and the very reason behind the swamping England with Orcs calling themselves British...

To be continued: